Boo Cheng Hau divulges insights into DAP’s leadership

theVibes.com:

Boo Cheng Hau divulges insights into DAP’s leadership

A polarising figure even among his peers, former Johor party chief is known to be one who does not mince his words

Ex-Johor DAP chief Dr Boo Cheng Hau says the people need to be aware about the party’s beliefs in social democracy, multiculturalism and equal rights through methods more substantial than attires. – Alchetron pic, December 12, 2021

Isabelle Leong

KUALA LUMPUR – Recently, Dr Boo Cheng Hau got into a heated argument with his own boss Lim Guan Eng over his critical remark on Segambut MP Hannah Yeoh’s decision to wear a selendang.

Speaking to The Vibes’ Isabelle Leong, the former Johor DAP chief divulges insights into the party’s leadership and its testy relationship with some of its allies, including opposition chief Datuk Seri Anwar Ibrahim.

Leong: Can you explain comments you made on Yeoh’s attire during the mosque visit that sparked the verbal exchanges between yourself and party secretary-general Guan Eng?

Boo: It was in a state committee WhatsApp group chat. It was a discussion (among us). You know, it’s a very sensitive thing when you say hijab and selendang, they are different things. When it comes to hijab, it has a strong religious connotation.

It’s usually what women wear for the purpose of prayer ritual and all that. I saw that on KiniTV and I find that it is kind of a strong word – hijab – to use. So, later on, they (Malaysiakini) started using the word selendang.

They (Malaysiakini) know they made a mistake. I did my research and found that there are differences in these headwear. Selendang is more of a Malay cultural thing, I think in English they call it shawl. It covers just the hair, as a show of respect. It doesn’t cover up the whole thing. Hijab is something that can go up to shoulder length, even down to the waist. It’s mainly more religious…also for praying.

I think it’s a good discussion. We are learning from debate to be more sensitive, rather than wearing it without knowing what it means. Of course, we don’t judge people by their attire and clothing. But when it comes to religious rituals, we need to know what we are doing.

Basically, that was the discussion and there’s other pressure that Malaysians are facing in the country now. The ban of liquor and playing up on the issue of Timah whiskey – I think we have to be more cautious, in terms of balancing the concerns of both Muslims and non-Muslims. We are a multicultural and multireligious country. So, we have to be sensitive to all races, not one dominant race.

Leong: After your comments in the WhatsApp group were made public, many said Yeoh’s wearing of the selendang was more of cultural appreciation and not appropriation. Could you help us understand this?

Boo: Yeoh has been a good representative. Whatever the attire she wants to put on, if she sees fit, it’s up to her. In my opinion, we have to go deeper into just attire. What the attire means and also what policies we have to balance to respect the rights of both Muslims and non-Muslims.

Last time, I defended her when she wanted to put her children’s name and race as Malaysian. I saw that she had a point of saying that we all should be Malaysians. But this for me, I think it’s a bit overdoing it. I think maybe she is under pressure because at one point in time, DAP was attacked as a Chinese and Christian party.

We cannot be what we are not. When people attack us in that way, we cannot back down.

We have our own identity. We try to be a multicultural party and we have done quite a good job. Even though the majority of us are Chinese, that doesn’t mean we are not Malaysians right?

So sometimes, we have to try not to appease anybody under pressure. We do the right thing and there should be a line to be drawn.

I have been to mosques and all, I always consult the committee. They don’t allow me in the prayer room because I am non-Muslim and that is okay. Usually, they will receive me at the lobby or the kitchen, we just have tea.

I even donated money to events, that time I received an allocation as wakil rakyat. But you have to consult them, and the committee will come to consensus, saying this is okay. But it is etiquette, we cannot overdress, overstep or overshine our host.

I don’t even go to donate money to them, (unless) they give me a letter saying that they have a consensus for a non-Muslim rep to donate money to them. There are also different parties in the committee. I don’t want to be seen as a divisive force among them. Usually, they will come back with a consensus if it is okay. We have to explain and give them a narrative on why we are doing it.

All this is a two-way mutual understanding and discussion. If we were to go to a Sikh or Hindu temple, they come with garlands and turbans, and we receive them because it’s an honour. They give it to us and it’s our honour to receive it. But this has to be discussed.

Leong: What sort of pressure are Yeoh and DAP facing for this internal discussion to end up being a matter of public scrutiny?

Boo: There was a period of time, I think between 2013 and 2018, Umno cybertroopers tried to portray DAP as anti-Malay, anti-Islam and a Christian-Chinese party. They also portrayed DAP as a pro-Zionist Christian party.

We were under pressure to rebut all these in a reasonable way. We should not overdo it just because people wrongly accuse us. We didn’t do anything wrong. We have to do things to prove that we are not anti-Islam and anti-Melayu, but not through superficial things.

We have to do something to explain to people about our party’s beliefs in social democracy, multiculturalism, equal rights and also the need for affirmative action. I think we need to do something more substantial than attires.

Segambut MP Hannah Yeoh’s (pic) donning of a headscarf during a recent visit to a mosque sparked an argument between former Johor DAP chief Dr Boo Cheng Hau and DAP leaders including secretary-general Lim Guan Eng. – The Vibes file pic, December 12, 2021

Leong: So, you are saying that DAP is adopting superficial gimmicks to appease certain ethnic groups to win votes?

Boo: Yes. I think we do. In my honest and frank opinion, I think we have some reps who have overdone it. And I think it’s a bit superficial. I even received messages from senior Malay civil servants – some are retired, some are present civil servants. They didn’t condemn it. They said what I’m saying is correct. Certain things, we overdo it, and we will be seen as politicking in their sacred religious places.

We must do it in a moderate and modest way where they feel comfortable, and we also feel comfortable.

I go to the mosque only on visitations. They don’t let me go into certain prayer rooms and I understand. I just dress decently, long sleeves and long trousers with proper shoes, that is good enough. They don’t ask us to dress ourselves in baju Melayu and all that. We as non-Muslim reps also take it as an honour to serve them.

Over the years, I think we have a good rapport. We don’t need to do things that seem superficial and pretentious. Back in 1999 and 2000, I proposed for DAP to have our own dewan ulama – a study group to specifically study Islam in an Islamic context on social democracy.

This is our party’s ideology, and multiculturalism, and we can relate it better so that the Malays can relate to our ideology better, which we could have done quite well in that respect.

Leong: When you say some leaders or reps are overdoing it, would it be because DAP is slowly losing support from the non-Malay community?

Boo: I think both. They are trying all these tactics Not only does it not work, but it also doesn’t gain Malay and Muslim support. I see that our reps would wear baju Melayu and take photos, selfies and wefies and they (the Malays) don’t buy it. Certain things like the hijab for them, is something very religious and sacred.

Let me be very frank, some reps take it more like a fashion show. That is not appropriate, and we should let that go and do something more substantial in terms of ideology, messages and party policies.

In terms of multiculturalism in the face of other political parties using race and religion as propaganda, it will be very tough for us.

Leong: Having said that, you are saying that DAP is losing support from both sides. With your open dispute with Guan Eng, is this a sign that the crack in the party is widening?

Boo: I don’t think so. To be honest, Guan Eng was not part of the discussion. A screenshot of a discussion in our state committee WhatsApp group was taken and manipulated, to shoot someone’s own narrative. They are certain community leaders I know who tried to shoot their own narratives.

I don’t message Guan Eng. We never had a discussion before he issued an open statement. I think it was taken out of context. I had to respond. I responded in a very polite way. I put out a very short statement about the crisis faced by the party.

I think things have been going wrongly. Before, we always say that we need to take care of all Malaysians’ concerns and their predicaments.

Now, everywhere they go, they say because we cannot get Malay support, we must pay attention to the Malays. This is not the right narrative. This is a very racist approach. We don’t want any race dominance because we must see all Malaysians as equals.

We see the majority, whoever that needs help and assistance, we must assist. Even if they are from a particular ethnic group like the Malays, we need to accept it and offer affirmative action. It’s not because you want to please.

If we just talk about Malay rights, then we can gain Malay support. How about the non-Malays? It seems like we have forgotten them. This is a very conservative and chauvinistic approach. It has taken the wrong path.

We must take care of all Malaysians and whoever that comes along. We must provide help. Whichever ethnic group, gender or any social group, special groups that need assistance, we have to provide. Everyone’s needs must be taken care of.

Leong: So, the party is solid? Cracks are not widening?

Boo: I don’t think so. Only a particular group in the party, trying to take the lead of the narrative in the wrong direction. Basically, we are a social democratic party. And also, more of a leaderless kind of ideology and approach. We cannot be seen going to the right-wing narrative who is conservative – which is already provided by Umno, Bersatu and Pejuang – all the race-based parties.

We have to create a new market for a better competitive age. We have to provide something new and different, two alternatives to our Malaysian people.

Leong: There have been calls from among DAP leaders for Anwar to be blamed for Melaka’s loss and be replaced as Pakatan Harapan (PH) chairman. Do you agree with this?

Boo: I completely disagree. This is a group of ministers and deputy ministers during Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamad’s government. I don’t call it a PH government because he doesn’t even believe in our manifesto. He was the one who said that we cannot treat the PH manifesto as a “Bible”.

That means we don’t have to follow it. I was the one who first issued a statement to ask Dr Mahathir to step down. Look at the damage done in 22 months by the PH government under Dr Mahathir. I don’t call it a PH government. It’s mainly a Mahathir government.

The damage was already done at that time, including policies like the anti-Icerd rally and many promises not materialised. Dr Mahathir called for a Malay Dignity Congress. That really does not apply to the whole PH foundation, which is multicultural, multiracial. which is going for a progressive all-Malaysian government.

Anwar was not part of the government.

The damage was done by Dr Mahathir and our ministers and deputy ministers, who were actually Dr Mahathir’s yes-men and yes-women.

Now the damage is already done, which was shown in the Tg Piai by-election. This domino effect has continued, and it has carried on to the Melaka election and it will happen in the Sarawak election. And it’s not truly Anwar’s fault because he was not in the government, and he had no full control of the government.

Now is the time for us to reshuffle and rebuild PH, and it will take years. We have to accept that. The group that wants Anwar to step down and to resign are the former ministers and deputy ministers.

They are the ones who should take on the full responsibilities and reassess their own performance when they were in government. They are the ones who caused damage to PH.

This is the group that is so eager to come back to power at all costs. They talk about abandoning Anwar, and they want Dr Mahathir to be back as leader because they think Dr Mahathir is the only one who can bring us back to government.

But they have forgotten that the government collapsed because of Dr Mahathir, and because of their own performance that has destroyed and damaged PH’s image. This is the group who asked Anwar to step down, they should step aside.

Dr Boo Cheng Hau does not agree with certain DAP leaders’ calls for Datuk Seri Anwar Ibrahim (pic) to step down as Pakatan Harapan chairman following the defeat in the recent Melaka state election. – The Vibes file pic, December 12, 2021

Leong: Following PH’s loss in Melaka, DAP lost four out of eight seats contested. DAP reps like Anthony Loke have been saying that PH must stop insisting that Anwar be its sole candidate for prime minister, and some have asked Anwar to step down. In DAP’s context, do you think it’s time that DAP takes stock of its own leadership, including Guan Eng’s position?

Boo: That is a tough question. I cannot tell my boss to step down! I think he has to understand. He has to take initiative to do the right thing. If we fight internally, it will be very worrying for the party. He has to make his own decision at an appropriate time, and we have to rebuild PH with a new, progressive and convincing narrative. And we do need young blood and new voices to debate on a new narrative.

A way to think about it, nobody has the calibre or experience to present a good and strong image as prime minister like Anwar at the moment. This is something to be discussed at the PH presidential council level and we will let them decide.

Leong: So, you are saying there should be a reshuffle in DAP as well?

Boo: I think we need a new line-up. But to have a new line-up, we need a debate. It’s not my personal decision. I have my own views; I think we need a new line-up which is more progressive, down to earth and pragmatic. We have to come down to really understand the ground, and rebuild the party’s image and organisation.

We need to give the young blood training. They will take some time. Those in the front must be both experienced and vibrant. It may not be their age but at least somebody with new and progressive ideas. That is what we need. We can’t go back to being conservative when we are a social democratic party.

Leong: So, the fresh line-up would include a change in adviser, secretary-general, and other positions?

Boo: I don’t want to be specific on the secretary-general. But in general, the whole line-up must have a mix, we can’t throw them out the window altogether. It cannot be all new ones because we need to have experienced ones who have been in the party leadership for some time.

So, in the state level administrative experience, we need both – those who are good administrators, and good fighters and good visionaries. We need a mix of all including professionals and grassroot workers. I think it’s all up to the delegates to decide in the upcoming party elections.

We do need a shake-up but before the shake-up, we need open debates. This is a good opportunity to debate on issues, even if it looks like a nitty gritty issue.

If it comes to policies, when we extend it to the policies, we extend it to our foresight and visions. We need to debate on the policies, and it involves the constitution and how to better it to make our multiracial country more progressive, more vibrant. This is my concern.

Leong: Perception is that in DAP, serious issues pertaining to policy statements can only be made upon the endorsement of the leadership?

Boo: When it comes to policy issues, we need guidelines and there are some guidelines. But it’s a free country and DAP is a democratic party so everyone can voice out their personal opinions.

Unfortunately, this discussion on WhatsApp was an internal thing, and someone leaked it out. Partly, just to realise their own agenda and narratives, which is not an ethical practice.

If they say whatever I said partly or take it out of context, it looks really bad. It seems like I am interested in women’s attire, which was not the key issue. The key issue was the substance of policies, how we can change to attract more support from both Malays and non-Malays, and we cannot go by superficial gimmicks.

DAP secretary-general Lim Guan Eng (pic) has accused Dr Boo Cheng Hau of being no better than an ‘extremist and primitive PAS leader’ over his remark on Hannah Yeoh wearing a selendang as a ‘superficial gimmick’. – The Vibes file pic, December 12, 2021

Leong: In the case of calling for Anwar’s head. Did it receive the blessing of the DAP leadership? Could it also have been mooted by it?

Boo: I cannot speculate. But we have to be consistent. We cannot be seen like a cart being pulled by horses in all directions. They have to understand that by calling Anwar to resign or even Guan Eng to resign openly, I don’t think it’s the right time or right way. We must discuss it in the PH presidential council.

I think this has been repeatedly said. Lim Kit Siang has also said openly, our choice is Anwar. We don’t take anyone outside of PH for a very good reason. Because we want a very strong, consolidated and united PH, as a leader to convince all of us.

Anyone can propose themselves to be the choice for prime minister, but within PH, we have to decide collectively. We decided to stand behind Anwar. It has been repeatedly confirmed by the presidential council to be our prime minister of choice, until today, unless he decides to retire.

I think his vision still needs time to be realised, including the one for a more multicultural “Asian renaissance” approach to better or have a more progressive and open society. I think this is lacking in Malaysia.

Indonesia has opened up to reform since the late 1990s, it’s already been more than 20 years. They made good progress. But there are some things that we are lacking in Malaysia.

The same old leadership, rhetoric and policies are still alive. So, I still have confidence in Anwar, who has proposed a very good vision of the Malaysian renaissance, which is not acceptable to only Islam, but acceptable to all believers of other religions.

I think that is the key issue, it touches all levels of Malaysians. From there, we can have a good start.

Leong: It is rare to see a DAP member, even someone as senior as you have an open quarrel with your boss. Are you worried about receiving disciplinary action from the party?

Boo: I don’t think so. I think I said the right things. As a doctor, I don’t hide the truth. We must be honest with our judgement. It’s the way I tell the patients, whatever the diagnosis, we have to be frank.

The same way I treat politics, at times, we make the judgement, whether right or wrong, we have to be very frank about it. Actually, my response was to his open condemnation of me, or reprimand of me. I had to clear the speculations and accusations by responding with the truth.

We are losing both non-Malays’ and Malays’ support. It showed in the Tg Piai by-election and also in Melaka. I think the Sarawak election will not be better than these two.

When he accused me of being no different than an “extremist and primitive PAS leader”, it was something that was uncalled for. We must respect each other.

PAS was our former partner, agree or disagree, good or bad, we have to part amicably, with due respect.

Calling them primitive and extremist, implying me as such, I feel it is uncalled for. We have to look into things more rationally and study the impact of what we say, what we do and what will be the future for the party, PH and our country.

I think that has to be where we put down the anger and be more rational, and to not take things out of context.

The Malaysiakini report took a very small and irrelevant part of my statements, which is the attire matter, but ignored the bigger issue – how we should make our party relevant, our party’s ideology or if social democracy is relevant to not only non-Malays but also to the Malay Muslims. That is the real substance of the debate. – The Vibes, December 12, 2021