But everyone (unless an unrealistic dreamer) knows that PAS being PAS will never resile from its ardent desire to implement hudud law, first in Kelantan and then in any states (including the entire nation) in which it wins majority rule, with or without its Pakatan allies.
In this political objective or, if you like, obsession, there's no difference between the party's ulama and Erdogen factions, notwithstanding conciliatory placating comments from the Erdogens (via Salehuddin Ayub) in response to Lim GE's warning.
It's only in their respective 'timing'.
The ulama wants it by "yesterday" whilst the Erdogens, aware of PAS' need to have its Pakatan allies by its side if it ever wants to win federal rule, are only waiting for the right strategic moment to re-invoke the hudud issue, probably at a time when it has overwhelming political support from other Muslim-majority parties like UMNO and the PKR Muslim faction. Then the DAP can go f**k spiders for all PAS cares.
Thus I feel we should not blame just Pak Haji Hadi Awang. Poor bloke, wakakaka.
Lim GE should have a look at its Sarawak membership who have effectively (and correctly) shunned PAS - for more, see Malaysiakini's What about S'wak DAP, PAS asks Guan Eng which reported:
Sarawak DAP last month announced it would boycott all state PKR and PAS events until the two parties clarified their stand on the implementation of hudud.
Its chairperson Chong Chieng Jen said while Sarawak DAP remains part of Pakatan for now, it would leave the pact if the PAS ulama faction wins the party elections next year.
To reiterate, I reckon it's not just the PAS ulama faction DAP should be wary of, but the entire party.
I'm not fear-mongering or being anti-PAS. We have already seen examples of PAS in power and its inconsiderate go-it-alone behaviour in Kelantan and Kedah, frightening indications of what it is likely to do when it comes into power again, and that have not been what we want to see again or re-experience.
Thus I do not believe in its claim that hudud is only for Muslims.
I am sorry to say this but Pakatan should ask PAS to leave and not continue with its current Faustian pact.
DAP, please remember 1999.
Thus I feel we should not blame just Pak Haji Hadi Awang. Poor bloke, wakakaka.
Lim GE should have a look at its Sarawak membership who have effectively (and correctly) shunned PAS - for more, see Malaysiakini's What about S'wak DAP, PAS asks Guan Eng which reported:
Its chairperson Chong Chieng Jen said while Sarawak DAP remains part of Pakatan for now, it would leave the pact if the PAS ulama faction wins the party elections next year.
To reiterate, I reckon it's not just the PAS ulama faction DAP should be wary of, but the entire party.
I'm not fear-mongering or being anti-PAS. We have already seen examples of PAS in power and its inconsiderate go-it-alone behaviour in Kelantan and Kedah, frightening indications of what it is likely to do when it comes into power again, and that have not been what we want to see again or re-experience.
Thus I do not believe in its claim that hudud is only for Muslims.
I am sorry to say this but Pakatan should ask PAS to leave and not continue with its current Faustian pact.
DAP, please remember 1999.
The thing is.......PAS wants to make use of their partners, and their partners want to make use of PAS, this is the crux of the matter. The big prize - Putridjaya.
ReplyDeleteSo in PKR's mind....once having the crown, they would become the Umno of Pakatan.
So, in DAP's mind....once having the crown, they would tell PAS to shelve their dream of ever thinking of turning the country into an Islamic state.
So, in PAS's mind.....once they have the crown, they would seize the PMship, telling Anwar to just indulge in having more coffee boys and to remind DAP that pendatang and kafir can NEVER have even a single say in how a Malay Islamc state should be run,
Semua sekarang pretending to tidur atas satu bantal, but all carrying knives in their sarongs, ready to stap each other to death AFTER they have come together to kill the big devil Umno first.
It is as clear as daylight. They are exactly like Ayatullah Khomeini and his fellow mullahs. They will NOT compromise in any way as far as their belief is concerned though making their way to the top of the mountain, and realising that they need your assistance during the journey, they are willing to make agreeable noises and pretend to be amenable to compromise. But once they have achieved their objective you'll be seeing a whole, new, different creature. What they desire will then be the law and no objection or even discussion will be entertained. Once they are in power evicting them will be the hardest thing you can ever do, more likely it will be an impossible task. By then the Nons will have only two options left - either quietly, meekly accept the situation and be dhimmified or emigrate.
ReplyDeleteHudud 'timing' !
ReplyDeleteIs UMNO any different ?
u mean dap is okay to pakat with a bunch of pkr hypocrite but not a horde of honest hudud fanatics? i think dap shd leave pakatan, not pas, remember 1999? unless dap r equally hypo.
ReplyDeletenever trust a man who claims to speak on behalf of god. he either misuses god's name to oppress & control people or he believes his oppression & control are for god
Deleteas for corruption we can deal with it - religious fanaticism? if you think you can deal with that, think ISIS and Ayatollah. think Gallileo
can agree, but isis is more likely a nationalism (communist also being labelled a terrorist what) movement, n ayatollah start a revolt, however pas want (trick) us to give them our "vote".
Deletegallileo is abt dare to know, read ellese n hasan n s18, would this muslim just follow a malaysia ayatollah blindly?
martin luther oso speak on behalf of god, he might even "twisted" god word...."man's individual responsibility to god alone", n there a renaissance n reform.
so the reform, renaissance, humanism initiate by many that speak on behalf of god, not a atheist, or a politician like lks or lge.
HY, you're wrong in suggesting ISIS is a nationalistic movement. There is undeniable fact that it is a Pan-Islamic movement to create/impose an Islamic State in the Levant region consisting of Lebanon, Syria, Iraq, Jordan, Israel and Palestine.
Deletehttp://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/29/opinion/thomas-friedman-isis-and-vietnam.html?_r=0
Deleteif u tryly comprehand what/how the chinese live thru the 19/20 century, u might have a diff understanding. the west perceive isis no diff with hamas, i know u r not, u would justify hamas with this n that, i opin both r quite similar, one can call them terrorist, but i felt the ethnic/nationalistic motive behind r not that far off from each other.
Agreed.
ReplyDeleteDAP and PKR should just dump PAS and take in new partners including West and East Malaysian Parties sooner rather than later.
It takes time for their new coalition to explain to Malaysians and work towards GE14. It also takes time for PAS supporters to gain increasing isolation all over Malaysia, starting with Sarawak and Sabah and its members will shy away from PAS in favor of other PR Parties available.
PAS will then have to fall back to Kelantan only politics. Let all those who want Huddud migrate to Kelantan happily and those who don;t agree to move away from Kelantan.
1 nation, 2 rules !
DeleteThat seems to be something like an autonomous state within a state, an independent nation inside a larger nation - like the Vatican which is a part of Italy but self-governing, or Hong Kong to Mainland China.
Delete"Thus I do not believe in its claim that hudud is only for Muslims."
ReplyDeleteI have to disagree with you. Actually, you know that hudud is only for Muslims. You are worried that hudud will be a prelude to other bigger things...i.e. as per your statement "implement hudud law, first in Kelantan and then in any states (including the entire nation)".
- hasan
Brunei isn't a bad example !
DeleteHahahaha! Brunei is a good example. Hahahaha! Okay, that cibai Hasan may have descended from Brunei and nong nong time ago comes from Kerala
DeletePKR - Parti Keluarga Anwar dan Rakan Rakan
ReplyDeletePAS - Parti Isis Malaysia
Both bloody useless for moving Malaysia towards a better future.
It would appear the best possible way forward would be Barisan Nasional and DAP coalition.
A marriage made in Heaven
Or
A marriage made in Hell ??
Hahahahahaha! Fuck you la! The best way is to let LKY to come back to Malaysia to screw kaytee. Hahahahaha!
DeleteThe slogan :PAS FOR ALL" and "HUDDUD FOR MUSLIMS" in reality means "PAS FOR MUSLIMS" and "HUDDUD FOR ALL". This is the real agenda.
ReplyDeletePAS has not criminalized anyone who enforces Huddud on a non-Muslim and with an equal penalty like chopping off hand and stoning to death. So how can non-Muslim be assured that it will not become "Huddud for all" in future? All they need to do these days are to issue a Fatwa saying " Huddud For All" in say 2016 and it become law.
Brunei is one example of how Huddud should be applied if at all; to all citizens of an Islamic country. You cannot have 1 country with 2 legal systems for the same offense.
Huddud is only a part of Sharia. Sharia is already in every State of Malaysia. Recent events confirms that Sharia law does affect the non-Muslims in Malaysia:
Examples:
1) Bible seizure by Islamic authority who is supposed to only enforce sharia on Muslims, but they entered a non-Muslim's place of worship and arrested non-Muslims.
2) Refusal of the IGP to enforce the High court order for the return of a child to a non-Muslim mother.
3) Arresting a bride during a Hindu marriage ceremony in a temple.
4) Covert conversions of Christians in East Malaysia and no action is taken.
The list is much longer right down to a unisex hair saloon, but these examples clearly shows how a non-Muslim can be affected by Islamic Laws. Especially with the kind of religious enforcers Malaysia has.
Actually non-Muslims are not afraid of "Huddud for Muslims". They are afraid of some abusive clowns enforcing it on them unjustly and those sentences are irreversible. A lot of illogical actions were done in the name of Islam. ISIS is one such tyranny of the majority who kills those who do not think as they think, all in the Name Of God.
"For there is none righteous, no not one". "For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God". "Let he who have not sinned cast the first stone".
So, who is righteous enough to police the Huddud, pronounce sentences and execute the presumed guilty? What if another Civil court found them not guilty at the same time?
I agree with KT that as an Islamic agenda of PAS, eventually, Huddud will be applied to all, if they get their way. And Malaysia is not ready until we have found truly righteous people in the eyes of Allah. Alas, where to find one who has no sin?
Is there any fucking cibai righteous fellow over here? Even kaytee thinks he is. Just read. Ah so
DeleteVery rightly put, anon 11.54 ! As KT have said, we can deal with corruption but it will be the death of us to deal with religious fanaticism. As for this guy looes74, apasal he accused KT as being righteous ??? Must everything be this blogger's fault according to this guy's continuous railings ?? He forgot to mention his cat again, LOL
DeletePAS/UMNO wanting to implement hudud is strictly for religious and piety reasons. I am sure it is not a political wish of Hadi. "Thus I feel we should not blame just Pak Haji Hadi Awang. Poor bloke, wakakaka."
ReplyDeleteOTH, on Tariq Ramadhan’s opinion that Muslims should not implement hudud just yet and to open it up for a scholarly discussion should not go unheeded too.
BTW, perhaps the discussion should also explore on the following too:
1. And he that blasphemeth the name of the LORD, he shall surely be put to death, and all the congregation shall certainly stone him. [Leviticus 24:16]
2. If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her; Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city. Deuteronomy 22:23-24]
3. If any man take a wife, and go in unto her, and hate her ... and say, I took this woman, and when I came to her, I found her not a maid: Then shall the father of the damsel, and her mother, take and bring forth the tokens of the damsel's virginity unto the elders of the city in the gate: And the damsel's father shall say ... these are the tokens of my daughter's virginity. And they shall spread the cloth before the elders of the city. ... But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel: Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die. [Deuteronomy 22:13-21]
4. If there be found among you ... that ... hath gone and served other gods, and worshipped them ... Then shalt thou ... tone them with stones, till they die. [Deuteronomy 17:2-5]
5. If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers ... thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die. [Deuteronomy 13:5-10]
6. If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother ... Then shall his father and his mother lay hold on him, and bring him out unto the elders of his city ... And they shall say unto the elders of his city, This our son is stubborn and rebellious, he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton, and a drunkard. And all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die. [Deuteronomy 21:18-21]
7. Thou didst blaspheme God and the king. And then carry him out, and stone him, that he may die. [1 Kings 21:10]
- hasan
which is why we should never ever COMPLETELY trust priests or monks
DeleteStones for stone age !
DeleteTry to show yr one-upship again?
DeleteU gamely ignored the fact that the modern Christians, especially the current breed of the liberal types whom r the majority , don't care two hoots about the Old Testament stories that u'd just mentioned.
They r more in tune with the modern humanity of equality irrespective of race, religion & gender.
KT & u r the dinosaurs who still think that those grandmother stories told in The Bible r gospels that r still relevant in these days & time.
Oooop... forget that u r one of those sesat Muslim!
Stoning stubborn and rebellious sons? There will be not enough stones in Malaysia.
DeleteGuan Eng is the son of DAP supremo,Kit Siang.But he doesn't have the smarts and political savvy of his father.His spoilt brat tantrums,kissing Anwar's ass and picking fights with Hadi like a jilted spouse speaks wonders of this immature political brat.
ReplyDeleteA Muslim cannot oppose Hudud outright....you can ask any of your Muslim friends or contacts...assuming you have at least one..... Muslim celup (pretend Muslims) don't count.
ReplyDelete"Who is Nor Omar"? "Nor Omar who"? "Never heard of him,never"?
ReplyDelete"Who is Azmin Ali"? "Azmin Ali who"? "Never heard of him,never".
"Never"? How about the dwarf"? "Dwarf"? "Do you mean KT's dwarf"?
"Now I know whom you meant"."Anwar's once upon a time ass licker"."Right"?
Hadi did not back PKR's first choice for MB.Hadi had stepped on LGE's tail by refusing to play ball and kissing asses.Now the "TOKONG' is so obsessed with Hadi,that it is his first priority to chop off Hadi's tail.A fighter of democracy and free speech?Hahaha.
ReplyDeleteWith Anwar Ibrahim going to jail soon, I believe Pakatan will break up sooner rather than later, with disputes surrounding the Islamist agenda as the root cause.
ReplyDeleteLim Guan Eng has to go !
ReplyDelete@ Anon10:59 pm,
ReplyDelete" Try to show yr one-upship again? " Wakakaka....
From John 16:7-16;
But I tell you the truth: It is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Counselor will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. When he comes, he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment: in regard to sin, because men do not believe in me; in regard to righteousness, because I am going to the Father, where you can see me no longer; and in regard to judgment, because the prince of this world now stands condemned. "I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear. But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. He will bring glory to me by taking from what is mine and making it known to you. All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said the Spirit will take from what is mine and make it known to you. "In a little while you will see me no more, and then after a little while you will see me." [John 16:7-16]
@ Teo Akbar 5.00am,
There is only about 300,000 Muslims in Singapore. So, perhaps you should blow up Batu Puteh and send the stones to Malaysia. Wakakaka…
- hasan
U DONT read well, right?
DeleteAah so, dinosaur has small brain & such a huge slacken body, so when a stink landed on the tail, it takes ages to reach the brain to register an reaction! More so a illogical one!
Or more likely, anything that u DONT like/understand/tolerate, u CAN only do wakakaking...... !
Did KT ask for any royalty yet, even though it's poorly exercised by quarter?
Here is something, perhaps u COULD understand. I just quote it from OTB, yr fellow Muslim.
'This is a terrible religion. A religion of hate. Without hatred this religion cannot survive. Whoever holds on to this religion of hatred, they also will not survive.'
Of course, u know I dont mean the one that u so frequently quoted, just now?
Ooop... could be it there is too much cleansing done to the holy book that there is none for a sesat like u to quote?
" 'This is a terrible religion. A religion of hate. Without hatred this religion cannot survive. Whoever holds on to this religion of hatred, they also will not survive.' "
DeleteAh... well that's from Syed Outsyed.... sounds like Syed Outside. Wakakaka...
- hasan
kaytee's opinion: every, yes, EVERY religion can be turned into a religion of hatred, according to the "priesthood caste" wakakaka. One of the earliest examples has been Judaism..
DeleteNote I didn't say 'X' religion is a religion of hatred but rather, can be turned into one.
Interesting point KT. But then do you think that the philosophy and the roots of hate are buried in every religion?
Delete"And the lord said unto the servant, Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel them to come in, that my house may be filled." [Luke 14:23]
- hasan
Hassan 8:22,
DeleteIf ever Singapore blow up Pulau Batu Puteh, the stones will be used to built subsidized homes for its citizens instead of stoning them to death. In Singapore, stone is a valuable commodity and they are mostly imported from Malaysia and Indonesia. It is an offence to throw stone in Singapore even against adulterers and disobedient sons and daughters, but precious stones such as sapphire and rubby are usually welcome.
hasan, Judaism purportedly started with Abe entering a covenant with God. God "chose" Abe because he was a good man, so said Abe's descendants, wakakaka. It's all about exclusivity or marginalization or ketuanan, hence we have the so-called "Chosen People".
DeleteAnyone here believe God would have picked one ethnic group above all his creations to be the "Chosen People", who coincidentally was so described by the very "Chosen People" wakakaka, and whose descendants today have spun up a new bullshit reason ("CHosen" menaing selected to pass God's message to others) because no one believes the earlier bullshit anymore. Oh, don't forget God was urging his "Chosen People" to kill everyone else, indulging their women, babes, cows, horse, asses, but sometimes excluding from the genocide "maidens who haven't lost their virginity", wakakaka.
I will soon blog on how the Judeans (Jews) began marginalizing all their brothers, sisters, uncles, cousins let alone neighbours.
Christianity also started off as a new State Religion and woe betided anyone who challenged the Emperor'w "fatwa" wakakaka (does this remind you of anyone, wakakaka again).
Frighten, threaten, prohibit, scold, punish, execute, also promise paradise - best way to control a population and hence a contry
I would not say you are wrong KT:
Delete"So he stood at the entrance to the camp and shouted, All of you who are on the Lord’s side, come here and join me. And all the Levites gathered around him. Moses told them, This is what the Lord, the God of Israel, says: Each of you, take your swords and go back and forth from one end of the camp to the other. Kill everyone—even your brothers, friends, and neighbors. The Levites obeyed Moses’ command, and about 3,000 people died that day." [Exodus 32:26-28]
- hasan
the Israelite god was a bloodthirsty fella who had to be appeased with blood and human sacrifices, for example (just one), every first born Egyptian boy was killed by the israelite god himself - now what did those babes do that was considered a sin to be so horribly murdered by god?
DeleteBut for Muslims KT, yours truly included, one cannot soften the message due to notions influenced by modern day thoughts and perspectives of how God should behave, even when one cannot fathom the purpose or the reasons behind what God ordains.
Delete- hasan
note I wrote "Israelite" god, meaning it was a tribal god worshiped by some shepherd race
DeleteWikipedia: "The ancient origins of Judaism lie in the Bronze Age polytheistic Ancient Semitic religions, specifically Canaanite religion ......"
DeleteChristianity sprang from Judaism ?
Christianity then evolved into .........
Christians accept many characters and events in Judaism yet they are different. Religion XXX in turn shares many Christian beliefs and yet they are different!
DeleteJohn 16:7-16 is about what the Christians believe. Jesus might seem to be talking in riddles and Muslims believe that the counselor Jesus spoke of refers to the Muslim prophet. But, the counselor is actually the Holy Spirit which Jesus has sent to those who believe.
DeleteOne simple fact that they didn't accept Jesus as savour and worst still like the muslims, they degenerate Jesus as prophet and declare Muhammad as the final messenger
DeleteAnyway, ktemoc is an atheist and he is banned from entering Malaysia because he violated the first tenet of rukun negara
It is time die hard supporters realized that the PR under the present leadership is not going to Putrajaya.Not now and for sure not for the next 100 years.This fuckers of dick suckers prefer to screw each's asses over no fuss.What else can Anwar,Rafizi and Guan Eng do,except to make a cow ass out of an asshole.They should do their supporters a favor and go play and shiok sendiri themselves.
ReplyDeleteWhen LGE first became the CM of Penang,he showed a lot of promise of an upcoming leader of the 2nd generation of opposition leaders.But he has really dissapointed me for his childless gimmicks and theatrics.Instead of acting like an elder statesman,he preferred to indulged in petty personal attacks against his PR ally Pas president Hadi.LGE has forgotten that he was appointed CM by the PR to govern Penang and not engaged in personal fights and acting like a gangster warlord.Screw this idiot kau kau.
ReplyDeletegigolo,
ReplyDeletenot that LGE is only acting like a warlord over petty issues.DAP leaders like LGE and Tony Pua has been smelling Anwar's smelly ass since the Kajang move.And not that they love smelling Anwar's smelly ass but they just love it when Anwar played their asses.
They laughed at the MCA leaders when they kissed Umno's asses.But these hypocrites are no better but much worse than their MCA sworn enemies.Because they are the laugh and be laugh clowns.
LGE? LGE who? Never heard of him,never.
ReplyDeleteTOKONG? You mean KT's TOKONG? Now I know whom you meant.Hahaha.
For screwing Saiful's ass and making him a very happy man,I am being made the victim,says who?.Go figure.
ReplyDeleteFaustian pact or no Faustian pact,PR can never capture Putrajaya.Not with such leaders like Anwar,Rafizi,Azmin,Lim Guan Eng,Tony Pua and their likes.These are boh lam par (balless) politicians.I think SIS members Anwar and Marina got more balls than all these NATO dudes combined together.This is the fucking fact,no BS.
ReplyDeleteLet those Pak Haji have their hudud in Kelantan.
ReplyDeleteWhen the time is right, Federal govt will take over Kelantan either by court ruling and by force.
As anything not in line with the Federal Constitution is null , void and illegal.
A couple of months ago, a group of us did our own (self-financed) "Lawatan Sambil Belajar" trip to Kelantan.
ReplyDeleteWe - 6 of us - are all non-Muslim, Klang Valley urbanites who love our Pub drinks and Non-halal delicacies. Our impressions of Kelantan had been formed by horror stories highlighted in the Mainstream media, as well as on blogs like this one.
So we decided to brave Kelan-tan (rhymes with Pakis-tan and Afghanis-tan) to see the truth for ourselves.
We were expecting to see crowds of Jubah - Turban wearing Kelantanese men, with Burka-clad women walking at least 10 steps behind,
and prepared to endure a "Dry" holiday and all-Halal diet for the duration.
So off we went in an MPV owned by one of our mates. Our host was a Kelantanese local of Siamese descent.
It was a long road trip.
To cut a long story short, we got to drink a lot of beer (readily available in coffeshops and Chinese eateries), ate plenty of pork dishes, visited one of the world's largest reclining Buddha statues (in the middle of a Malay kampong) , prayed at one of the world's largest sitting Buddha statues (again in a rural "Heartland" area).
One of our members wanted to get his hair cut by a female hairdresser - no problem finding one in KB.
All in all, I would say this - PAS-run Kelantan is not what many people think it is, including this blog's Australian owner
Has Ktemoc gone "missing" ?
ReplyDeleteNo new posts and no moderated comments for 3 days
Maybe run out of fresh Anwar-PKR targets ?......Wakakaka......
Raja Bomoh is a fucking maid abuser.So much for the 1M Rajah Bomoh.
ReplyDeleteKaytee,you have been so quiet these last few days.Are you been charged and detained under the sedition laws?
ReplyDeleteI think Ktemoc is gone.....wakakakaka
ReplyDeleteIt has been quiet around here lately. Blogger's fatigue?
ReplyDeleteI heard Ktemoc died and has gone to join Osama ben Laden and Ariel Sharon in a very bad place....
ReplyDeleteLikes like old Monsterball outlasts Ktemoc......wakakakaka....
ReplyDeleteHe who laughs last , laughs best
Eh....dah mati ke ni ?
ReplyDeleteBagus lah.
R.I.P.....
r u in stasis and to be awakened only after ge14?
ReplyDeleteKtemoc is no more.....(background music....Handel's Death March..).....
ReplyDeleteKtemoc.....MAY YOU REST IN PEACE.
ReplyDeleteKtemoc has gone to see the Israelite god....and be punished for his many insults...
ReplyDeleteWhere are you Ktemoc, it's been a long while and am missing your blogs
ReplyDelete