Thursday, October 04, 2007

The necessary demonization of Lee Lam Thye

Why has my post on Leave Lee Lam Thye alone attracted adverse comments, both against me and Lee? But never mind poor kaytee - why Lee?

I hope you critics who like to ‘give’ can also ‘take’ from me, and hopefully at the end of a robust debate, we can still be mates and split a bottle of brew, whether that be sarsi or something stronger – OK then, hang on then ..... incoming!

Here is an outstanding former DAP stalwart who was the best performing opposition politician bar none. Neither my political hero Lim Kit Siang nor the late Tan Sri Dr Tan Chee Khoon could match his popularity and the respect the people of KL of an earlier generation have for him.

Yet to today’s political Johnnies & Ginny’s-come-lately, he is a
“hypocrite, a spineless turncoat who goes with the flow. His past actions have clearly shown he is a ‘yes-man’ and ‘brown nose’ and he is certainly not independent nor trustworthy”see comments on the post.

So, on the above pseudo-logic, for Lee to be trustworthy in the amoebic minds of these J’s-come-lately, he must be, according to their tadpole worldviews, a ‘no-man’. Oh yes, he must buck the ‘flow’ in accordance with their wondrous views of which way the ‘flow’ has been going. Yes, Lee should bloody well conform to their dictates or ‘de facto’ assessments.

What about the critics themselves? Certainly they would say ‘no’ to the establishment! But what would they say to the man who can walk on water.

No, I wasn’t referring to Yeshua ben Yusuf, but the bloke whom visitor kittykat46 informed me
“Didn't you know the guy practically walks on water?” in an earlier post Guess who've been singing that old tune "I'd have been sacked ..."?

Read the above post and see whether Lee Lam Thye or He who walks on water has been a ‘spineless hypocrite’.

And pause to consider whether you critic wonders of Lee Lam Thye aren’t ‘yes men’ yourselves (to He who walks on water, the unelected 'leader') ?

And where is it stated that Lee must act or opine in accordance with your Winching Wendy wishes to be not spineless - oh, don’t you now dare forget to compare Lee with who’s really spineless.

As I mentioned in Lim Kit Siang - question mark over 'Lingam Tape Investigation Panel' regarding an inquiry or an investigation:

“A fundamental advice to conveners intending to hold an inquiry, no matter whether it carries a Royal Commission or otherwise, is that they should know beforehand what the findings would be.”

“If that cannot be 100% assured, limit the terms of reference to ensure desired finding …”

Now, it’s not that kaytee believes the independent investigating panel would turn up anything illuminating, because as we are informed by Malaysiakini, the three-member panel probing the authenticity of the
'VK Lingam' video admitted that the panel is limited in their power to compel witnesses to come forward or to extend protection for them.

That’s what ‘limiting the terms of reference’ can do without requiring the need to have biased panel members.

While I believe former Chief Judge Haidar Mohd Noor should not be on the panel investigating into a matter involving the independence of the judiciary because he has a ‘conflict of interest’, I do not see Lee Lam Thye in that same position.

As I remarked in my post Leave Lee Lam Thye alone, F-think carefully before making such an unfair and unworthy comment/criticism, without knowing his history nor understanding Lee's personal style of interaction!

I had questioned the biased criticism that “Lee hasn’t made any statement contrary to or critical of government policies without first taking the wind directions” by asking the following:

(1) Must he?
(2) Has that been his style even when he was at his pinnacle?

Visitor Shadow Fox commented: “You speak with hypocrisy. There're bigger issues at stake now than just bread and butter issues. If he wants to be left alone, it's very easy, he only needs to back out from the panel.”

“Since he allowed himself to be on the panel, he should expect to be scrutinised to the fullest.”

“This is what democracy is all about. Can't take the heat ? Get out of the kitchen, or in this case, the panel.”

It’s quite obscene for him (or her) to mouth the phrase “This is what democracy is all about” while at the same condemning Lee, as a citizen who has retired from opposition politics, from accepting an invitation to be a panel member. Hellooooooooo, can Lee be allowed to decide for himself, or should he toe your line?

And as a former opposition politician retired from active politics, if that doesn’t make him an independent person, who then is? He who walks on water? Lee as an independent person is under no f-obligations to say things that you only want to hear.

Democracy, my bloody foot - you have no clue what democracy is!

Shadow Fox continues to show his/her ignorance of the phrase “Can't take the heat? Get out of the kitchen” by applying it to a retired politician sitting on an panel for independent investigation, but WTF, why let facts bother the mealy-mouth attack on Lee.

However, Shadow Fox said something quite correct in his/her “There're bigger issues at stake now than just bread and butter issues.”

And that's what I’ll discuss next … and it won't be pretty ;-)


  1. Dear Sir,
    I bet you do not know this man Tan Sri Lee Lam Thye, for those who think he as a good DAP in the 80s, think again, he was a >$10m man BEFORE he left DAP!
    You may ask me why? The answer is very simple and direct: not only those that in power corrupted in our boleh land, those leaders who are in opposite camp also multi $$$ millionaire!
    Don't believe me? You can check them up! Some of them even own more than 200 arce of land!
    Now you know why you are doom, and where we are heading? HELL!!!

  2. When LLT “retired” from politics I remember reading in the press that he mentioned the reason for that decision was because he needed to think of his family’s future. In other words he retired from opposition politics because he needed to make money for funding his family’s needs - children’s education etc.

    Come to think of it that seems a lame excuse. Opposition MPs earn a decent income. And with his popularity at the time he would not have been found wanting for offers from the private sector. But he chose to take up offers from government-controlled companies.
    And he was vain enough to accept a Tan Sri-ship. He no longer wanted to be just addressed as citizen LLT; I presume he wanted to feel the thrill be being addressed as Tan Sri.

    Now I do not know of anon’s claim that LLT was a >10 million dollar man at the time of his retirement. If anon can show proof of that, then that completely gives the lie to LLT’s public statement that his decision to “retire” was because he needed to think of his family’s future.


  3. KT,

    I have generally liked your posts in the past. This post, I don't know what it is about. But I do know a simple fact expressed in one sentence:

    This panel to merely determine the authenticity of the Lingam tape, that does not have the power and more importantly *refuses* to even try to call on Lingam himself, is a joke and a sandiwara.

  4. anon of 7:50 pm - mana proof? then you went from LLT to "You can check them up! Some of them even own more than 200 arce of land" - you must avoid this type of 'carpet bombing' if you want to knock LLT down - or it'll be seen as just a cheap shot at someone "you don't like" rather than someone who's corrupt

    anon of 9:36 pm - you said "And he was vain enough to accept a Tan Sri-ship. He no longer wanted to be just addressed as citizen LLT; I presume he wanted to feel the thrill be being addressed as Tan Sri."

    was that substantially fair? another Opp leader, the late Dr Tan Chee Khoon (a good man) also accepted a Tan Sri - I would love to see Lim Kit Siang get a Tun - afterall AAB's wife can get a Datuk Sri so certainly Lim KS should be honoured with a minimum Tun (not that I care about awards but I want to see a less stupid divisive system of awarding honours to mainly BN people)

    and what's wrong with taking up offers from govt-controlled comapnies? I think this attitude of them and us shouldn't extend beyond political policies

    gh - my post wasn't about the panel per se and if you read my comments, its terms of reference have restricted it - that's not the fault of the panel but teh person who convened it. my post is more about defending LLT because I see it as being fair and due to him - I don't like to see him being criticised for not siding with the Opposition - why does he have to? as a matter of personal declaration I don't side with Anwar Ibrahim because I see him as just an UMNO person, and not the best of that lot too, no, would be the other way around, but I still consider some PKR members as friends - that's the whole point!

  5. The three member panel is just a camouflage and it is a tool to show to the rakyat that the authority is concerned and is doing something to resolve the problem. To make it convincing, one "good" guy must be there and that is Tan Sri Lee lam Thye. As time goes by, the heat is cooling down and people is getting fed up and quiet down, the whole case can be swept under the red carpet and "happy ending"

  6. "Opposition MPs earn a decent income."

    I would just like to point out that although that is technically true, in reality the amt of income they take home is limited. In DAP's case a substantial chunk of the income of each MP goes to DAP federal coffers to keep the party machinery running on a federal scale (e.g. running the party newspaper).

    On top of that MPs will often need to spend their own cash on branch-level expenses. BN MPs do not have this problem - most branches will get more cash than they need.

    Although they are certainly at no risk of going hungry, they are certainly not enjoying a huge disposable income either.

    I can't speak for other parties, but I imagine the situation is very similar.

  7. Hi KT,
    On LLT, I repeat that I very much respect his past work as MP for Bukit Bintang.

    But these days he's too much of a regime man. I wouldn't consider him an appropriate "independent party" who can be counted upon to carry out the work of the Lingamgate panel without fear or favour.

    Aside from that, its pretty clear now, the terms of reference of the Inquiry Panel has made it castrated, deaf, dumb and mute.

    Its just a useless exercise in whitewashing.

    I was being deliberately ironic about "the guy who walks on water"...heheheh....

  8. He is a political opportunist. If he is a person of high principles, he should quit the panel. He is a disappointment to his past supporters.

  9. when you want a person to change his bad habits , you can resort to many ways. Firstly, you can try by by scolding him. The end result is often that he would not even listen to what you say.

    Another approach is the soft approach, advocated by dale carnegie. Find out his good points, praise him about his good points, and when he is feeling well, then you start to tell him how he could be better if he change his ways.

    Often, this approach is more effective, in marketing, in sales, in politics and in people management, in negotiation. Chou En Lai is such a good negotiator because he is soft but firm, often praising the enemy and gained the trust and goodwill of the enemy even when all the time he stood firm on his ground.

    Lee is of course no Chou En Lai. But he has done a lot for the urban folks especially those around Bukit Bintang areas during his days as the BB MP.

    When he has done what he has set up to do, it is his choice that he moves on in life to another areas. We have to repect his choice.

    When I blogged on National Service and called for a review some time back ( the article also came out in malaysiakini and NST as letter to the editor) , he took the trouble to find out my number to call me and discuss. And he has implemented many suggestions that I have given him, namely, providing trained medical personnel to each camp, have more variety of food, less military style of training etcc. As regards to my suggestions to suspend the whole thing, he of course has no such power, and that power lies with the DPM.

    What he has done is what he has always done. Try to work within the system, to right certain wrongs and alleviate sufferings of people from within the system.And always listen and discuss with people on the ground.

    I doubt any other big shots in his position would take the trouble to call a blogger to discuss.

    Under the circumstances,without his efforts , things would be worse for those young trainees.

    I have always advocated a Royal Commission for the Lingam Gate incident. But that does not mean that those on this panel are not trustworthy - it is more a case of this panel has no real power to go to the bottom of the case, unlike a Royal Commission .

  10. KTemoc
    You call the late Dr Tan Chee Khoon a good man who also accepted a Tan Sri-ship, in justifying LLT’s acceptance of same. I disagree with “the good man” bit. Tan Chee Khoon was lauded by the government-controlled press as Mr. Opposition. Sure he was allowed to bitch a bit and get away with it, just like Mahathir was allowed to bitch about the U.S. and allowed to get away with it. The government allowed Tan Chee Khoon to bitch a bit because it gives the impression Malaysia is a democracy. And Tan Chee Khoon, being a founding member of the opportunist Gerakan party which threw in its lot with UMNO after May 13, was allowed that leeway because of his and Gerakan’s accommodation with UMNO. In the same vein the US allowed Mahathir to get away with his bitching because in the US’ global scheme of things Mahathir and Malaysia was unimportant. Mahathir could only get the ear of the US president and be granted an audience in the White House after payment a fee of some US$500,000 (or maybe even more), foreign news reports allege.

  11. by taking up as a member of the panel, he is subject to the highest scrutiny of his independence. Is he not the Chairman of National Service? Is he not a director of Prime Media, which is controlled by UMNO. with such cozy relationship with the powers-that-be and of course the largesse that comes along, is it not right for us to quesion his impartiality and therefore his integrity?

  12. The truth is always painful to hear, but in LLT case the criticism of him is generally true. If he had an ounce of integrity in him, he would immediately resign from the lame duck make believe independent investigation panel.

  13. Anonymous at 11.45 says "In the same vein the US allowed Mahathir to get away with his bitching because ............White House after payment a fee of some US$500,000 (or maybe even more), foreign news reports allege".

    I disagree with the conclusion. What the US did was a simple matter of them snubbing Mahathir off. An act by an arogant country who believe everyone have to follow their way. The act does not reflect the status of 'importance'. I bet if Mahathir were to lick the US president *SS, I am sure that he will received more than a red carpet wellcome. Better than his former DPM could ever imagine. Anyone seen to be opposing Mahathir , while he was the PM, would definitely received extraordinary treatment from the US.

    I dont think you need to be an intellectual to understand the above fact.

  14. anon of 11:45 am - you have been grossly incorrect to state "Tan Chee Khoon, being a founding member of the opportunist Gerakan party which threw in its lot with UMNO after May 13, was allowed that leeway because of his and Gerakan’s accommodation with UMNO".

    when lim Chong eu took the gerakan into the bn after may 13, dr tan left gerakan to form perkemas - he was a man of principle. but like LLT he didn't yell or boast or ask his people to take to the streets to terrify others. he wasn't grandstandingly (empty barrell) confrontational but addressed bn bad policies in a clinical manner, the way he as a doctor was trained to do

  15. KTemoc
    You wrote: when lim Chong eu took the gerakan into the bn after may 13, dr tan left gerakan to form perkemas - he was a man of principle.

    It is documented fact that Gerakan threw in its lot with UMNO almost immediately after May 13. Pekemas was formed in 1972 and was TCK not still a Gerakan member before finally breaking ranks with Gerakan? And what were the real reasons for him breaking ranks with Gerakan, and for Pekemas’ dismal showing at the 1974 GE, which led to the demise of the party?
    Many of us were born after 1969 and would not be too knowledgeable about the politics of the time. I would be grateful if you could offer us some enlightenment so we can fill in the gaps in our knowledge.

    It also is a well-known fact that Tan support the NEP, which would have endeared him to UMNO and thus given the leeway to bitch a bit about government policies, earning him the accolade of “Mr. Opposition”.

    May I also add that I have enjoyed this debate with you, and look forward to more of the same. That’s because you are unlike some other bloggers who, having achieved some degree of popularity and recognition from the public, really seem to think they can walk on water and therefore resort to hurling insults against commenters who hold different views.


  16. LLT need titles and wealth to do what he needs to do today...without tan sri...will he be invited to be a panel member in almost anything that involve our society?
    He is still working like he used to be 20 years there anybody at his position who want to have the trouble to dig into peoples' shit...better go for a holiday in Havana and check the investment blog...:)

  17. I have known LLT longer than most of you. He is an effing "human headline". When he was in the DAP he would do anything to get his name in the papers, even if had to comment on the state of the then public toilets in the multistorey carpark in Chinatown.

    He had little steel in him and even that only showed because he respected (or feared) Lim Kit Siang.I rather have Kit or Karpal on my side any day of any week.

  18. I think LLT was lured by BN to leave DAP with handsome rewards, just like the 3 katak in Perak. BN wanted to make use of his popularity and his image of honesty then. BN would think that in this way DAP would loose a pillar in the party and thus crippled it. No wonder LLT said that he had to think of the family's future. Come to think of it, those in the opposition party have made a lot of sacrifies, because whatever business you do, BN makes sure that you will not be successful.